Stephen Hawking posits that philosophy is dead -
A recent WP writer posits poetry is dead -
So, dear reader, i (yes, a small i for i do not claim to know) posit to you -
are they dead?
If yes, what was the cause of death, discuss ~
what say you…
Posted by angela on 2013/01/30
http://yellowhousecafe.wordpress.com/2013/01/30/what-say-you/
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The Other Watson
/ 2013/01/30No way. As long as people drink alcohol, there will always be philosophy. As long as people fall in love, there will always be poetry.
angela
/ 2013/01/31or vice versa ~ a
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/30If it were dead, how could I have found my way to it? How could 35,000 people have found their way into Modpo? They said God was dead back in the day too.
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/30I would submit that, with all due respect the Profeasor Hawking, he tends to be way off the mark when commenting on fields other than his area of expertise. It’s been years since I was read his big best-seller and I was left with the feeling that he should have stuck to physics. (I apologize for forgetting what my specific criticisms were- it’s been many many years- but I was left disappointed. I’d have to reread it to remember what I felt was wrong with it).
angela
/ 2013/01/31Mark, I’ve not read the book – it seems Hawking opened one of his most recent books with that line. It was mentioned in the philo class via Coursera… this blog may just get philosophical for a while, warning ~ a
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/31So much the better!
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/31I read the book (_A Brief History of Time_, I believe it was called), in 1988 when it first came out. A lot of years and a lot of life experience has accrued since then- I had only just graduated high school, so I was plenty young and dumb.
I don’t remember much about the book. I remember being fascinated by the astrophysics (I think this is the book that first indicated to me the idea that the universe might keep expanding forever, or it may end up collapsing on itself as an inverse of the Big Bang). I do remember Hawking commenting on something outside of the science, and being uttterly appalled and disappointed by how limited his view was. I can;t remember at the moment what it was, but I came away with the impression that this was a man who know a lot about the universe but very little about life. I have to see if I can find the book (if I still have it) and see what it was that brought up such a strong reaction.
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/31Strange! I found the book easily enough- I had it upstairs on the bookshelf. I skimmed it- I don’t have time to read it thoroughly right now- and I can find nothing of the sort of stuff I mentioned above.
Perhaps my memory of his book (and my negative reaction to it) had less to do with Hawking and more to do with who I was at that time of my life. That alone makes it worth a rereading.
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/31“Up to now, most scientists have been too occupied with the development of new theories that describe what the universe is to ask the question why. On the other hand, the people whose business it is to ask why, the philosophers, have not been able to keep up with the advance of scientific theories…in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries , science became too technical and mathematical for the philosophers, or anyone else except a few specialists. Philosophers reduced the scope of their inquiries so much that Wittgenstein, the most famous philosopher in this century, said, ‘The sole remaining task for philosophy is the analysis of language.’ What a comedown from the great tradition of philosophy from Aristotle to Kant!”
- Stephen Hawking, _A Brief History of Time_ (1988), pp. 174-75.
angela
/ 2013/02/01Oh wow, Mark, that is a eyeful of words, but something that makes one think, no? As I was reading the quote, I immediately thought, “is H discounting Wittgenstein?” only to read the next line. It is perplexing, though, for today steeped in my fog of illness I decided to skim Wittgenstein’s Philosophical Grammer which was is filled with his mathematical theory (I shall never read that portion for understanding). I disagree that philosopher’s cannot keep up with the advances of science….perhaps this course will help me to name a few at a later date (philosophy is NOT my forte) ~ a
Eric
/ 2013/01/30Until he knows everything, philosophy will exist as long as Man does.
angela
/ 2013/01/30very insightful, Eric, thank you!
Joe Grobelny
/ 2013/01/30they’ve always been dead, we keep them alive in our minds. makes sense that hawking thinks they’re dead, as for petri, i liked coldfront’s response:
http://coldfrontmag.com/news/open-letter-to-alexandra-petri
angela
/ 2013/01/31thanks for the offering, Joe! I wonder if you caught HTMLGIANTS post Do i believe he has it right…meh, to some extent for to me ‘dead’ is not doing/thinking/offering anything ‘new’. In both philosophy and poetry, I think there is still room for new, but that person has to be without need of a crowd ~ a
Joe Grobelny
/ 2013/02/01man, seth’s in deep. liked his direction though i think he went overboard on the “capitalist system” bit, and on demanding that “in order to consume and compose poetry one must be special.” i’m not an avid poetry reader, but that seemed a bit harsh, as though you can’t separate the mundane from capitalism. you’re right though, the new should look forward to a crowded field (seems like music is in the same boat).
C.B. Wentworth
/ 2013/01/30Poetry is alive and well as far as I’m concerned.
peculiaritiesandreticences
/ 2013/01/30Here’s what say me:
http://peculiaritiesandreticences.wordpress.com/2013/01/30/zeitgeist/#comment-469
angela
/ 2013/01/30Thanks for link, Mark – hitting wall (trying to write follow-up post) but will read tomorrow for certain ~ a
RoSy
/ 2013/01/30The world would have to be dead for philosophy & poetry to be dead.
angela
/ 2013/01/30I like your thinking, RoSy ~
umaanyar
/ 2013/02/01I would like to shift the conversation from the’ death of Philosophy and poetry’ toward what is the latest thinking by philosophers. The general consensus is that we are past postmodernism. But where are we NOW ? Who is worth reading on what the pulse of today? Poetry is fine. It will always be fine. Some people care about it more than others and this has a lot to do with the actual language. ( example- Russians are far more passionate about poetry than say Americans) Why? Maybe it has something to do with language and how it forms our thinking. ( if interested in this idea, read the article on the invented language~ Izthauil in a recent issue of The New Yorker… it is great food for thought) So maybe studying Language is the point of Poetry and Philosophy, I would love to learn who to read. Who is the new Derrida, Foucault ? etc? And,speaking of Languages Why have the French produced the last batch of influencial thinkers who have shaped our times?
angela
/ 2013/02/01what great questions! I am a novice, though, taking a Coursera Philosophy class that has rightly caused me to think on a broader spectrum. I’ve been terrible about staying current w/ New Yorker, going to hunt that article down now…perhaps it will inspire another post. I’ve oft wondered the dominance of the French as well and have several ‘theories’ though not anything concrete nor without my own bias, so shall not respond…do you have any thoughts?
umaanyar
/ 2013/02/02The article on the constructed language is moving, sad and wonderful because a man worked for years with no recognition reinventing … well… the world itself… through Language (a perfect language that will become corrupted If you can’t locate it. it should be in one of the last 5 issues. I’ll check my various piles of reading materials and direct you tomorrow. I think the France takes philosophers seriously Like Russians love Poetry. A tradition honoring the intelligencia resides in both cultures. but that is only the start of it anyway Those are my initial thoughts. I plan to check out Coursera… I gather you like it . how many courses have you taken? and which ones? thanks keep blogging you are good at this.
Susan Scheid
/ 2013/02/02Funny to think, I’ve simply never worried about these “dead” proclamations. If a subject is alive for me, that’s all I’ve needed to know.
Carl D'Agostino
/ 2013/02/22Science defines what is and how it works. Philosophy defines how and why things are to be used.